"Sir, are you trying to show off your knowledge?" The translator's tone was sincere when he relayed Uncle En's words. It was obvious that he was emotionally invested.
Vézé had gone from being thick-skinned to being shameless many years ago. He acted as if nothing had happened when he was questioned like this. "The foundation of Marxism is science that is constantly improving. If Marxism can't develop with the progress of science and technology, it will become Marxist fundamentalism or communist fundamentalism. In my opinion, historical materialism is so simple, so simple, and so close to life. It is detached from life and put on a high pedestal. That is the method of playing with religion. This is not the attitude of science. "
Uncle En smiled slightly. Generally speaking, this was what he said to the European Communist International. Their understanding of communism was similar to Vézé's sarcastic words. They thought that it was a slogan that could be used as a banner, a totem that could be used to resist all injustice. As for what the totem itself represented, the European Communist International did not study it much. In contrast, China did not promote communism much, but it did not seem to be a special promotion in China.
"Sir, could it be that what you said just now was correct? Isn't it a denial of human autonomy to think that everything is determined by material things? "Vézé's content about the structure of the brain gave Uncle En a lot of inspiration. The image of Vézé using a magnifying glass and a scalpel to cut the brain of a living person inexplicably emerged. Even though Uncle En knew that Vézé would not actually do that, he still felt a strong sense of danger. This kind of strong speculation was very rare for Uncle En.
Vézé leaned back on the sofa. He liked this question very much. "Science has nothing to do with right or wrong. Science is a kind of attitude, a kind of method. Historical materialism believes that we grasp the relative truth, not the absolute truth. However, if we can continue to develop along the scientific attitude, we have the opportunity to grasp the absolute truth with accumulation. I actually hope that someone can come up with a more scientific theory of brain structure and human behavior. If we have that kind of accurate knowledge, we can become more powerful. "
"But with such a precise analysis and such a clear result, wouldn't it become fatalism?" Uncle En smiled and looked at Wei Ze. He actually liked this question very much.
"If someone else were to ask me this question, I probably wouldn't be able to discuss this kind of air-to-air problem in a relaxed manner. One of the most common reactions of humans was to first accept a seemingly absurd but temporarily undeniable scientific theory against their will, and then make some idealistic comments and speculations about this theory. When those empty statements could no longer be justified, they were forced to expand according to their own thinking. In the end, in the illusion of helplessness, there was a decadent attitude of 'nihilism'. This was the attitude of an individual. If this attitude was extended to the entire country, the collective mentality of not being able to solve the problem would cause the country to show signs of decline. So, Mr. Engels, I can discuss all kinds of issues with you very easily, but when it comes to the social level, I have to be cautious. This is not a matter of fatalism, this is a kind of social problem that is easily caused when productivity can't solve the problems people face. "
Vézé spoke at length, and Uncle En listened quietly. This view of attributing all problems to the level of productivity development made Uncle En feel that something was not quite right. The liberation of productivity could indeed solve many problems, but Vézé was the first person Uncle En had seen who put all the problems above the level of productivity development. This attitude of only talking about productivity without talking about production relations made Uncle En feel a sense of danger. "
Uncle En suspected that Vézé never mentioned production relations because he didn't want to talk about this problem with foreigners, but after thinking about it carefully, Uncle En felt that it was unlikely. In the letter with Uncle Ma, Vézé never opposed the role of productivity in production relations. Such a person who paid attention to the development of productivity would not turn a blind eye to production relations in any case.
Thinking of this, Uncle En asked, "Sir, why don't you talk about your implementation of these theories?"
"All the specific implementation has brought me very negative feelings, so I can't talk about this." Vézé replied.
This time the comrades were dumbfounded. They stared at Vézé and even stopped their translation work. If it was only this sentence, the translators probably wouldn't be so stunned. The content of this conversation had always been beyond the imagination of the comrades, and the sharp and straightforward content had always brought quite strong negative emotions to the translators. If Vézé boasted that he had overcome all negative emotions like a living god, the comrades would probably feel a sense of balance. Now Vézé actually frankly admitted that he actually felt heavy negative emotions because of this. The translators felt very bad.
If Wei Ze walked silently to the edge of the Bitter Sea and sailed in it by himself, he would not be able to do so. The translators had nothing to say. Now Vézé quietly showed the sea of bitterness to everyone. After everyone saw it, he didn't say enthusiastically, "Everyone, follow me, we will definitely get through this difficulty." Instead, he chose to say expressionlessly, "Everyone, just endure here endlessly, because I am suffering like this too." Such a leader was simply a representative of incompetence.
But the translators quickly recovered. It wasn't because they recovered psychologically, but because their professional training made them subconsciously choose to continue working in this situation.
Uncle En wasn't surprised by what Vézé said. If Vézé happily said how he could solve all the problems, then Uncle En's evaluation of Vézé would probably be "a very good liar". If these hardships could be easily overcome, human beings would have entered a communist society long ago. So much blood had been shed in revolutions around the world. Hundreds of millions of people had died in the revolution that broke out in China more than 30 years ago. After paying such a huge price, China had only made great strides in anti-feudalism. So far, there had been no system and theory that could make people's eyes light up. Even though Uncle En knew the difficulty of a system and theory of construction, he couldn't help but feel a little disappointed.
Thinking of this, Uncle En said to Vézé, "Your Excellency, Karl has always had a question. Will you be a revolutionary or the greatest anti-revolutionary? In Karl's opinion, you have outstanding ability, far-reaching vision, and executive ability. You have pushed human society forward a lot, but this doesn't prevent you from becoming the greatest anti-revolutionary in history. The standard to judge whether you are a revolutionary or an anti-revolutionary is that everything you create will eventually belong to public or private ownership. "
The translator didn't expect this foreigner to speak so bluntly. He actually dared to use the word "anti-revolutionary" to describe Vézé, the greatest anti-revolutionary. After translating, the translator looked at Vézé, who didn't seem angry at all, and felt even more unhappy. Was the Military Governor Vaize so polite to outsiders? Why wasn't he angry when he was criticized by foreigners to this extent? Even if it was for those who admired Vézé, there should at least be some objection.
Vézé obviously didn't notice the mood of the translator. Uncle En conveyed Uncle Ma's opinion really touched Vézé. He replied without thinking, "Mr. Marx really thinks too highly of me. It's an impossible task for me to completely reverse private ownership by myself."
Uncle En nodded. He always thought that Uncle Ma's requirements for Vézé were too harsh. It was so harsh that it didn't seem like something that a historical materialist would say. If an individual's ability could completely reverse the world, there was only one possibility. That was, the world had reached the point where it only needed the meager power of such a person to complete the last step. In today's world, not to mention the capitalist system was still strong and powerful, even the feudal system had not completely entered the garbage heap of history. Vézé's evaluation of the feudal system really expanded the depth and breadth of social theory to a considerable extent.
The elimination of land enfeoffment did not eliminate the feudal system. The enfeoffment of power was also a feudal system, and a higher level of feudalism. Moreover, this kind of enfeoffment of power was more hidden and deceptive, which meant it was more reasonable.
Of course, the current world was far from the time to discuss these issues calmly. Too many people in the world were struggling on the edge of starvation. The rise of China only allowed industrial civilization to cover the entire earth at an astonishing speed. Ten years ago, there was probably still Africa outside of industrial civilization. The agreement reached by the major powers to divide up Africa five years ago forced this last non-industrialized land to be involved in the global wave of industrialization.
On the current earth, both sides of every border were industrial countries, or at least agricultural areas with industrial countries standing behind. The war that broke out in North America was a war between two industrial countries, and in other areas with tense relations, military conflicts were likely to break out at any time.
He hoped that Vézé alone could solve all the problems and lead the entire earth to a brighter future. Uncle En thought that people who had such ideas were underestimating human beings too much.
Just as Uncle En sorted out his thoughts, Vézé spoke. "Both public and private ownership must be the means to solve the current problems. If both public and private ownership can solve the current problems, of course, I will work hard to promote public ownership. But when only private ownership can solve the problem, I will also choose private ownership. Just like the food and beverage industry in our country, I really can't solve it with public ownership. But in industries like water, I must solve it with public ownership. These problems can't be solved by a simple ownership relationship. "
Uncle En agreed with this very much. The world may be very simple, but simple slogans can never really explain the true nature of the world. Just as he was waiting for Vézé to elaborate on this, Vézé said, "Mr. Engels, I personally hope that you can stay in China. I wonder if you are interested in this? "
"Sir, do you want me to work for you?" Uncle En had also thought of such a possibility, so he asked very frankly.
Vézé's tone was equally frank. "I personally don't need others to work for me. For those outstanding people, it is a joke to ask them to work for others. Even those who are not at your level, Mr. Engels, can clearly understand that everything they do is their own choice. I would like to ask Mr. Engels to participate in the work of building a more advanced system in China. I personally think you may be interested in this work that can put your social ideas into practice. "
"Do you treat your subordinates with an attitude of mutual equality and respect?" Uncle En asked.
Vézé didn't like this way of asking, and talking through an interpreter didn't make Vézé feel friendly, even with a big shot like Uncle En. He said as calmly as possible, "I don't have subordinates around me. I am surrounded by comrades who have similar political views as me. The reason we gather together is not because they belong to me, but because they also belong to a political party that shares the same political ideas. I am not asking you to join the Restoration Party, but to stay in China and participate in the work of building a new system. "
"So you are not asking me to join your government?" Uncle En asked in a European way.
"We only have a government of the people here, and the official name of all governments is the People's Government. Even if you want to join my government, you won't be able to find a government that belongs to me. "Vézé smiled bitterly.
"I am not joining the Restoration Party, nor the government, so where do you want me to play a role? Is it to exercise power as your aide or secretary? "Uncle En went straight to the point, and indeed hit the nail on the head.
Vézé was speechless for a moment. If he didn't belong to a political party or the government, then Uncle En would probably only have the identity of a private minister of Vézé. But this was not a problem for Vézé. "I would like to invite you to join the Party School and participate in research as a professor of the Party School."
"Academic institution?" Uncle En muttered to himself.
"Yes, as a science, historical materialism naturally exists in academic institutions." Vézé replied perfunctorily. The conversation lasted for a long time, and Vézé felt that his mood was not as full as it was at the beginning. More importantly, Uncle Ma's evaluation of Vézé did affect Vézé's mood a lot.
In the 21st century, there was a view in Vézé's circle. It was because Uncle Ma creatively put forward a revolutionary program that revealed the nature of capitalist operation. Therefore, he saved capitalism. "Das Kapital" was indeed worthy of its name, which was to turn capital operation into a science.
Later, the Soviet Union appeared, and the European and American capitalist systems had to criticize and oppose Uncle Ma's theory on the surface when they were fighting for hegemony. In fact, they learned from Uncle Ma's theory. Between 1950 and 1970, there was a situation in Europe where the scale of state-owned enterprises exceeded that of private enterprises.
But with the collapse of the Soviet Union, Europe and the United States felt that they had won against communism, so they proudly announced that communism had failed. In Vézé's view, the failure of the Soviet Union was not necessarily related to the failure of communism. The communist system was a system that human society had to adopt after the productivity had developed to a certain level. The Soviet Union was a country created by the Soviets. There was no necessary connection between the two.
Originally, with such a detached mentality, Vézé had never paid attention to the banner of the social system. He didn't expect that Vézé didn't pay attention, but Uncle Ma did. In the end, he even labeled Vézé as the "biggest anti-revolutionary". If others scolded Vézé like this, Vézé would just laugh it off. Deep down, Vézé felt that most people in the world were more reactionary than Vézé. However, in front of the founder of the sect, Wei Ze's heart was always empty. What's more, the problem of public and private ownership was so difficult to solve. Vézé also knew that he couldn't achieve any fundamental change in his life.
Just when Vézé was depressed and wanted to end the conversation, he heard Uncle En ask, "Sir, I want to ask a question. What do you think of the people's democracy? "
"The people's democracy is a process, not a result. Does Mr. Marx believe that the model of one person, one vote can really solve the problem? "Vézé was angry in his heart, and his words were a little harsh. The translators were unexpectedly full of emotions. After the foreign devil made a series of extremely disrespectful questions to the Military Governor Of Vaize, the Military Governor Of Vaize still tried to recruit the foreign devil. Although they didn't dare to tamper with the words, the negative content of the translators' emotions could be imagined. Now that the commander in chief was a little unhappy, the translators were happy.
Vézé had a lot of considerations about this. This part of the content was something that Vézé was very dissatisfied with. So he spoke a little faster, and his tone was a little dignified. "I think that the people must be working people, and the equivalence of rights and obligations also needs to be discussed."
"Do you look down on the people?" Uncle En sensed something.
"No!" Vézé shook his head vigorously, and in order to express his emotions, he waved his hands repeatedly, "The people are the smartest, the wisest. Because they are different from those who are high above, they have to face real problems every day, and they have to carry out life and production practices. So the people know what happened, and the people know best where the problem is. People who look down on the people are the most stupid people. But the people know what happened, and the people are normal human beings. At this time, the level of productivity is so low that it can't provide the people with the means to solve the problem. I don't mean that the people lack subjective initiative, the people who can solve the real problems are indeed those who practice. But the contradiction is very complicated. "
Uncle En listened to Vézé's words and almost blurted out, "Do you want to build a world with you as the core?" But Uncle En held back. It was easy to criticize people with such words, but there was often no relationship between criticizing others and solving the problem. Uncle En understood this very well.
"Sir, I can't accept your invitation now. But I will be staying in China for the time being. Please allow me to travel and investigate in China, "Uncle En said.
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